Recently when I visited Bangladesh, I found two of my cousins had just finished a web design course (I can't remember which one but its in Dhaka). After asking them, they told me that they had learnt some html syntaxs and stuffs like that (BTW, they were beginning to introduce themselves as web programmer :shock: ). When I asked them about some basic graphics design, they were simply speechless and was looking at me as if I was talking some alien language. They spent around 11,000 taka for this course and I they were not taught anything about graphics design at all. I remember when I had my computer business in Bangladesh, I met many people who liked to introduce themselves as computer engineers (in reality, nothing more than a novice technician working for a computer firm without having any academic qualifications). I feel people (both old and young) in bangladesh are more interested in IT related identities rather than actually digging into it. And if this is the case, then what is the it future of the country?
In general, what do you think the quality of IT education in Bangladesh including universities and other private sector institutions ?
Hmmm....was it a tough topic to discuss :roll: _________________ Keep your own dignity, both online and offline throughout your life !!!
Wed Apr 28, 04 4:12 am
dinangkur Super Moderator
Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 491
Location: Dhaka, Bangladesh
Post subject:
Is it a tough topic to discuss? Oh! yes. I've a lot of experience with such situation from 1998. What is use for computer in Bangladesh? Easy to watch pronograpy(don't need to bring TV and VCR from drawing room to own room, lol), can dig a lot into the internet to search pronography, at the end of month when parents ask why the bill(dial-up) in too high? I was looking for universities and scholarships. Hehehe...
Believe me most of the people don't have any idea what to do with that box except watching movie, listening musics. We're still living in stone-age.
And I'm not crazy to ask anything to young guys(done courses in APTECH or NIIT) and engineers of computer sales firm. I had my lesson. Wasting time and enegry.
The future of IT in BD is in dark age unless govt. tries to do something.
-DK. _________________ ...we too are stardust...
Wed Apr 28, 04 3:18 pm
quantum Site Admin
Joined: 07 Mar 2004 Posts: 1048
Location: Dhaka, Bangladesh
Post subject:
They spent around 11,000 taka for this course and I they were not taught anything about graphics design at all....
This is one thing about how some of the institutions are making fools of the computer illiterate people. Franchise Software Schooling. 1-2 year course for 40-80,000 tk. to learn flash and maya! These softwares are designed to be learned by self study. Or hell, you learn them just by playing with the buttons. That's how I learned them. Schools like NIIT, aren teach through a smoke screen. As we all know,these kind of softwares , all have some basic layouts for the interface. This smoke screen methods usually works for those, who do not know or has not enough experiences with the computers to guess that, one does not need special instructors to teach him/her the details of the interface works. And for some tips and tricks, he can turn to the net. The rest is really, upto his creativity and practice.
More...later. Mastermind, actually I was/am waiting till I could sit down kooly and post something thoughtful. _________________
Dust fills my eyes / Clouds roll by / and I roll with them / Centuries cry / Orders fly / and I fall again
Afford best design, implement best solution. Outsource your web design.
I'm happy to see that I'm not alone on this. I remember sometimes ago I was expressing my doubts about IT future in BD to one of my friends and he started a flame war against me accusing of being passimistic,..bla..bla...you know the usual 'golabazi'.
I was a student of North South University (the SO CALLED one of the best private universities in BD...ya). The whole administration and the academic staffs were full of their ego. Specially, the CS department was a total crap (atleast when I was there a few years back). I saw many of my friends suffered severely and dropped out purely because of the institutions stupid ego. It almost ruined my life too until I decided to come here at the last moment. I can write a whole lot more thing about that uni from my experience.
dinangkur wrote:
The future of IT in BD is in dark age unless govt. tries to do something.
Partially true. But Isn't there anything at all we individuls can do? For example, though I can have a much better life here, I still intend to return to BD (and I will next year, hopefully). But I'm not sure what job I'll get. To be honest, I would like to teach at any university but I heard its very difficult to get there unless I have some kind of backing. The same thing for other jobs as well. Many of my relatives are saying that it will be a great mistake if I go back. Sometimes, I really get confused. _________________ Keep your own dignity, both online and offline throughout your life !!!
Thu Apr 29, 04 3:43 am
dinangkur Super Moderator
Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 491
Location: Dhaka, Bangladesh
Post subject:
This is not a country where a person can make any difference. Take me as an example, I droped out from DU and went to Cyprus to study MIS. I did my associate from there, came back worked few years and then went to Australia(came back after 2 years due to family problem), doing my last semester from BD. In the mean time I worked several places. From PC assembelly to customized accounting softwares for firms. Did I make any difference? NO.
People are not willing to pay and respect someone's professional attitude. So, I've decided to settle outside. I'm totally pissed of. Most biggest problem is that if I stay more 1o years here I will be a IT crap. I won't learn anything. So, I say your relatives are right (100%). If you don't agree with me. Come here for 3/4 months. Hunt jobs and see my yourself.
-DK. _________________ ...we too are stardust...
Thu Apr 29, 04 11:35 pm
quantum Site Admin
Joined: 07 Mar 2004 Posts: 1048
Location: Dhaka, Bangladesh
Post subject: IT of BD
I lived in Canada and USA for a total of 5 years. I came back last year. I never liked the idea of working for someone else. So I started Quantumcloud. Which was until last year nothing but a personal web site of my 3d playworks. How was the experience for the last year? Difficult, yes. People do not understand. My marketing people are having hell of a time to make a million taka(lol)business director understand what a web page is. They still mistake email address for web sites. They keep claiming they have web site, whereas what they really have is a free email address somewhere(probably someone even took money for doing that for him). They won't pay 1/5th of the money for a digital yellow pages, on printed. There are software works. It's expanding. But you have to have links. Same goes for everything else.
What is the main problem here? I would say education. People are very illeterate. What do you expect from them? The sum total of internet surfers are not more than 200,000. Businesses are reluctant to spend money on a sector that does not have a wide viewer range. Other bottlenecks are the lack of broadband and e-transaction method(credit card, pay pal). Any e-solutions from BD so far has been minimum. We cannot take the full advantages of the internet. Look at any popular bangladeshi site? What are they about? Model pictures and chat. What is this? People from BD create web site for Bangladeshi people. Really, how many americans create web sites, solely for america? Besides broadband and e-commerce limitations, lack of global thinking is also a big factor. Do we really have nothing original to contribute in a larger perspective?
Easy to watch pronograpy(don't need to bring TV and VCR from drawing room to own room, lol), can dig a lot into the internet to search pronography...
Yes, most young people do that. But so what? That is not the problem. The most popular search term in any search engine has always been sex and porn. And not 1% of that traffic came from BD. Young people will always do that. You have to give them good content so that they do somethings besides porn. A lot of young people also go to ACM site regularly. But why not to a similar site created by BD ppl? Cause there is none. None that has such global appeal. Another problem is the generation gap. The older people, who are really in position to spend money to develop the sector has not caught up with this sudden change yet. Specially the net. So even youngsters surfing porn sites, is a relatively good thing. They will know, when they grow up, that there is a thing called internet that has billions of web sites, and they provide important services besides porn.
DK,
The future of IT in BD is in dark age unless govt. tries to do something... This is not a country where a person can make any difference. Take me as an example, ....People are not willing to pay and respect someone's professional attitude. So, I've decided to settle outside. I'm totally pissed of. Most biggest problem is that if I stay more 1o years here I will be a IT crap..........
Really DK, what did you expect? You will get a 50 grand job here, just because you visited a few western countries where you saw a wealthy, educated environment? So did those countries all jumped just up there without crawling first? Our country is poor, illeterate and that is the reality. If you really want to do something for her, ask yourself what you can give her, not she has given you. She is your mother, not lover. Why would you be a IT crap, when you have still access to net and a zeal to learn? When one intends to learn, he can learn from anywhere.
Did I make any difference?
Yes, you made a difference. But it was too small. To make a big difference, you will have to work much longer and innovate something really useful. Making a difference is not as easy as I came, saw, and won.
Mastermind,
Partially true. But Isn't there anything at all we individuls can do? For example, though I can have a much better life here, I still intend to return to BD (and I will next year, hopefully). But I'm not sure what job I'll get.
If you are a graduate or masters in csc, it will be fairly easy for you to get into a private university as lecturer. And you can start from 15-20,000 I guess. Because, currently people hodling such positions are not really from computer sector 100%; physics or mathematics department. And most of them are from older generation that are dying out. But let me tell from the perspective of an employer. I had to take a few interviewes looking for software developer and marketing people. Skilled, honest, and dedicated people are very hard to find. Just recently I was talking to a media person(u know, job consultency). He told me that he got 4 jobs in hand for oracle developer and management. He can't recommend one person for those. Those who really know the stuff, ask for 60-70,000/month. Most just are not skilled enough. So there is a chasm here.
But as I always believed, if you have the skill, patience, and confidence you can make it anywhere. Question is where you really want to fight your war? I chose BD instead of USA. USA already has enough and she can do without me. Bangladesh is still in the dark ages of IT. Kool, so there are still a whole lot to do here and leave my foot prints. _________________
Dust fills my eyes / Clouds roll by / and I roll with them / Centuries cry / Orders fly / and I fall again
Afford best design, implement best solution. Outsource your web design.
DK, I understand what you say. But personally I want to come back to BD MAINLY because of my responsibilities to my family and my parents.
quantum wrote:
If you are a graduate or masters in csc, it will be fairly easy for you to get into a private university as lecturer.
I hope you are right. I'll be completing my MSc (Software Technology) next year. To be honest I'm not looking for a lot of money. All I want is a decent, respectable job.
quantum wrote:
I had to take a few interviewes looking for software developer and marketing people. Skilled, honest, and dedicated people are very hard to find. Just recently I was talking to a media person(u know, job consultency). He told me that he got 4 jobs in hand for oracle developer and management. He can't recommend one person for those. Those who really know the stuff, ask for 60-70,000/month. Most just are not skilled enough. So there is a chasm here.
Though I agree with you about the recruitment, I think there is another side of it. In BD, many times employers ask too much from the prospective employee. I understand they want to get the best the can with their money but the thing is when they recruit someone, they expect the new employee to know almost everything. I don't know about any company in BD that have some kind of training programs. Most company don't even have any basic induction programs and expects the new employee to jump into the work straight away. As a result, people try to know everything and become 'jack of all trades but master of none' (in fact in BD, many of them are identified as specialists with wide knowledge in IT!!! which is completely BS) . I think this is one of the basic reasons for this whole problem. We need some REAL SPECIALISTS (in specific areas of IT). I've seen many people who are really good in their stuff (maybe the scope is limited). All they need is a little guidance and time to gain experience in working in a proper office environment and they can fulfill the requirements of the employer. But again I must admit that there are a lot of bogus people out there who just pretend to be smart and know things. Many people just grasp some latest technical words and pretend to be an expert. So, yes it is a difficult task for the employers as well.
Anyway Quantum, as you mentioned about oracle developer and you are already in the business, I was just curious to know what kind of IT skills organizations in BD feel in need ? (Perhaps I'll try to expertise in some before I return to BD :D ) _________________ Keep your own dignity, both online and offline throughout your life !!!
Tue May 04, 04 8:06 am
quantum Site Admin
Joined: 07 Mar 2004 Posts: 1048
Location: Dhaka, Bangladesh
Post subject:
I understand they want to get the best the can with their money but the thing .....programs. Most company don't even have any basic induction programs and expects the new employee to jump into the work straight away.
I agree with you. That is why,I like people with initiative and enough intelligence so that they can be trained into anything effective.
I was just curious to know what kind of IT skills organizations in BD feel in need ?
Oracle is an obvious choice. Another field that is getting popular and useful is multimedia. Specially 3d. One big reason is that it already has a ready-made market. TV commercials. It also reduces costs for the advertisers and it has that look-new feeling.
Web development and e-commerce can be a very big thing in the future, once we get connected with the sub marine cable. India is getting all the out-sourcing job right now. But soon the western market will look for even cheaper market. Bangladesh will be one of the choices, if we have the properly trained population to catch the jobs.
Quantum, its really amusing for me to see that there are indeed a lot of similarities the way we think. Anyway, personally, I would like to stay away from multimedia and web development as a lot of people are already in that field and a lot more will be in the near future as this is one of the soft areas of IT (well..thats what I think ). I just don't wannabe another number in the croud. As I said before, ideally I would like to join at any university when I'll return. One of the main reasons behind this is that I've seen and learned so many things about teaching here that I want to apply those in BD. Here, I'm simply astonished to see the teacher-student relationships, the teaching methods, sincerety of the teachers..etc. I truely believe if I can implement even a portion of these methods in BD, we'll get a lot of really good graduates (not just certificate holders!). But, in todays world I need to be prepared for anything as there is no absolute guarentee that I'll get the job I want. I know about databases. So probably, I'll concentrate on that more in my free time. Thanks for your advice. _________________ Keep your own dignity, both online and offline throughout your life !!!
Thu May 06, 04 4:19 am
dinangkur Super Moderator
Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 491
Location: Dhaka, Bangladesh
Post subject:
What ever you people say!
Do you know what I want?
1. Enough money(saving money from salary), so I can travel once a year for few days.
2. No ties or suit.
3. A coffee machine.
4. A linux PC.
5. A GCC complier.
6. Internet connection.
7.24 hours open office.
8. Books.
If anybody can give it to me. I will go any where, also to hell. Hey I can make a database for those criminals, hell gaurds work will be easy, LOL.
-DK. _________________ ...we too are stardust...
Thu May 06, 04 12:52 pm
quantum Site Admin
Joined: 07 Mar 2004 Posts: 1048
Location: Dhaka, Bangladesh
Post subject:
Mastermind,
You are welcome. I will keep you informed, if I get to know anythingthing interesting.
DK,
Wow. I wish I could write down my aim in life in so few short sentences! But I guess I can help you with at least some of these requirements. _________________
Dust fills my eyes / Clouds roll by / and I roll with them / Centuries cry / Orders fly / and I fall again
Afford best design, implement best solution. Outsource your web design.
Thu May 06, 04 10:42 pm
dinangkur Super Moderator
Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 491
Location: Dhaka, Bangladesh
1. Enough money(saving money from salary), so I can travel once a year for few days.
2. No ties or suit.
3. A coffee machine.
4. A linux PC.
5. A GCC complier.
6. Internet connection.
7.24 hours open office.
8. Books.
If anybody can give it to me. I will go any where, also to hell. Hey I can make a database for those criminals, hell gaurds work will be easy, LOL.
Quantum wrote:
I guess I can help you with at least some of these requirements.
Don't listen to Quantum !!! I can help you with ALL of these requirments. GET YOUR OWN BUSINESS _________________ Keep your own dignity, both online and offline throughout your life !!!
Sat May 08, 04 3:58 am
dinangkur Super Moderator
Joined: 24 Mar 2004 Posts: 491
Location: Dhaka, Bangladesh
). I just don't wannabe another number in the croud. As I said before, ideally I would like to join at any university when I'll return. One of the main reasons behind this is that I've seen and learned so many things about teaching here that I want to apply those in BD. Here, I'm simply astonished to see the teacher-student relationships, the teaching methods, sincerety of the teachers..etc. I truely believe if I can implement even a portion of these methods in BD, we'll get a lot of really good graduates (not just certificate holders!). But, in todays world I need to be prepared for anything as there is no absolute guarentee that I'll get the job I want. I know about databases. So probably, I'll concentrate on that more in my free time. Thanks for your advice.
